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Molly Magid: Welcome to UC Science Radio, where we interview a range of postgrad students to tune into the fresh voices entering the world of science and learn what sparked their passion. I’m Molly Magid, a Master’s student in the School of Biological Sciences.
Today I’m talking with Clare Wilkinson. She’s a PhD student studying geology. Her research focuses on how the rivers in Kaikoura responded to the 2016 earthquake. She has also researched how mātauranga Māori and Māori values can be included into geomorphology research.
Kia ora Clare, welcome to UC Science Radio.
Clare Wilkinson: Kia ora Molly
So, you're studying geology but specifically what is your research about?
:I think I should start from the beginning, my PhD journey is a bit of a story. So when I first arrived to UC, my project was very strictly within geology and geomorphology. And I was going to be looking at how some of the rivers around Kaikoura, most heavily influenced by landsliding from the 2016 earthquake, were dealing with the sediment and moving that sediment downstream. And as I started my literature review, I came across this phrase called "landscape healing" a number of times in different papers and research proposals and things like that.And the phrase kind of stuck with me— I felt like if I was going to be learning about how these landscapes were healing, I needed to consider not just the physical processes but also the way the people in the landscapes were also healing.
And so I thought, who would be better to talk than Māori, the people who know these landscapes so well and have such a long, traditional knowledge of these landscapes, and so I sought out some supervision from Māori academics and they were from all these different research backgrounds, and yet we were able to find some common ground and I wouldn't have been able to have done my work without them so I'm very thankful for them.
So I was very fortunate to have my supervisors Angus Macfarlane, Dan Hikuroa, and Matthew Hughes get on board. And in addition to my senior supervisor Tim Stahl who really helps me with the technical science side of things, I've been able to develop this project that looks at landscapes at different scales using technical science methods to study breach scale and catchment scale processes—how's that sediment being moved downstream, at what rates, and things like that. But also being able to talk to specifically Māori about their perceptions of landscapes and how landscapes change after major perturbations such as an earthquake.
So, what have you found in comparing how the landscape has changed over that time after the earthquake to how people have perceived it changing and have thought about it?
:I think one of the biggest things for me is talking to my Māori participants who we brought on board to the research team, to the research group, they made me realise the implications of landscape change. And how major alterations to landscapes aren't just, you know, earthquakes, but they’re deforestation, it's flooding, it's tsunami, a whole web of physical processes, but also cultural processes as well and cultural change.
And how have you found your research changing as you've learned more about these indigenous knowledge or the mātauranga Māori that are already in place in this country and have been used for many, many years?
CW: That's a great question and I might have to give you kind of a round-about answer for that one, but something that I've had to learn and realise is my positionality as a non-Māori, non-indigenous researcher working in this space. It's not my job to produce mātauranga Māori, in fact I can't. What I can do is create space for it alongside my science. There has to be a recognition that you're not trying to force one knowledge system into the other, you're not trying to use one to prove the other wrong or prove the other right. They're independent and the role of the researcher is to find space, find the nodes of overlap between the two.
And so, in my work I use the He Awa Whiria framework, and He Awa Whiria means braided river. And it is a framework that my supervisor Angus Macfarlane developed with others. The idea, if you can imagine a braided river, and we're lucky that the metaphor resonates so well here in New Zealand, you have these big, wide river valleys, you have multiple river channels, sometimes they come together, sometimes they diverge. And that's the metaphor for weaving the two knowledge systems together. They can occupy independent strains, but throughout the research process, they come together, they inform each other, you use one another to check in and say: "Ok what were the things that I wanted to be accountable for in the mātauranga Māori stream, and am I meeting those with my science?" And also it can go the other way as well, mātaranga Māori is knowledge, it is dynamic, it is contemporary, and so it can also be informed by science.
You know, I've gotten very fortunate to receive some support from a lab in Australia, from ANSTO,and they were processing some of my river sand samples. And so I got to go there and see some amazing technology, and I think the coolest thing was even being there surrounded by the technology, because I had the social science side of my project where I was talking to Māori about landscapes, I was always still thinking of that, even when I was in the lab. These technological advances are amazing, but in the back of my mind is: "Ok, what will the implications of my work that I can produce with this amazing technology be?"
What do you hope those implications are going to be?
CW: That is a good question. I have just gotten back some of my final lab results. Basically, although I've come a long way from the initial concept of "landscape healing," I'm still kind of thinking about landscape recovery time frames. If the sand tells us it takes so many years, a huge range of years, for the landslide sediment to move out of the catchment. And the cobbles, the bigger sediment, tells us a different time frame, and then my participants indicate that there's a different time frame over which that sediment movement and other responses to landscapes are important, then that's kinda of how I envision tying them all together, is just through this concept of time human timescales vs. catchment timescales vs.deeper timescales.
How can these big changes like earthquakes or removal of trees change the sediment that gets in river and how it flows and what are the implications of that?
: We have to start with vegetation really and the overall makeup of a landscape. If you can imagine a river that has very shallow, flat floodplains on either side with lots of trees,the sediment will kind of be locked in place. And then on the other end of the spectrum, you have a river in a deep canyon, with really steep mountains on either side and there may be less vegetation there to hold rocks in place. And so you can have anything on that spectrum.
But if the vegetation isn't there to hold the small, fine sediment in place, it'll get into the river, and the vegetation loss can be caused by fire, deforestation, landslides, you name it. But when the sediment's in the river, for the most part it's kind of just doing its thing, and the river's doing its job of moving the sediment out to the river mouth and out to sea. But there'll be all kinds of different ecological implications and especially once all that fine sediment reaches the shore, pretty big implications on any aquatic life just off the river.
For example, one of my study areas in Kaikoura, and one of the implications of the earthquake was all of this fine sediment coming though the river systems, and the kai moana, the sea life there, they were already struggling from the uplift from the earthquake, and then with all the river sedimentation clouding over their environments, it has implications for the productivity of those ecosystems. And I'm definitely not an expert in the marine side of things by any means, but I am, I would say, more aware from having conversations with my participants that that’s an important implication of sediment moving downstream.
What's the most fun or exciting part of your work?
:Getting to spend time with my participants. So through my PhD project, I was able to bring five Māori individuals on to my participation team, and I held semi-structured interviews with them and talked to them about their perceptions of landscape-altering events, landscape change. And going to visit them in their local landscapes, in the places that they connect to, was really special. Sitting out on the seaside talking about the mountains behind us and the rivers behind us and the moana, the sea, in front of us. It made me reflect on how I think about the world around me and what I want my research and my science to deliver.
That brings me to my last question for you which is, what's one big change that you'd like to see come out of your research?
CW: I would love for more Earth surface scientists to consider how their work might be of interest to, of relevance to, of benefit to indigenous communities, not just within Aotearoa, but outside of Aotearoa New سԹas well. There has been some really incredible work in all parts of the world recognising the connections between traditional science and indigenous knowledge, and even though there's so much of it, there's not very much in geomorphology, in Earth surface science. I've always thought, you know, with the intricacies of indigenous place names and different classification names for different parts of the sea floor and things like that, there's so many linkages between Earth surface science and indigenous knowledge, and I would love see some other people in geomorphology consider the possibility of branching out and considering other knowledge systems.
Thanks so much for talking with me, Clare, I really enjoyed our conversation.
CW: Well thank you for having me!
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